EuroMaidan / ͺβπξμΰιδΰν (1)



 - Forums - Sign Up - Reply - Search - Statistics - Rules - FAQ -

 
 - ΣκπΰΏνρόκΰ - Πσρρκθι - English - Deutsch - 


Ruslana Forum / Ukraine / EuroMaidan / ͺβπξμΰιδΰν
. 1 . 2 . 3 . >>
Author Message
cora
Moderator
# Posted: 6 Dec 2013 22:25 - Edited by: cora
Reply 


Karolina
Is this thing true? Whaaat? I'm shocked with this statement of her. I mean it's horrible what is happening over there and I realy suport Ukrainian people, but to burn herself... Is this even I mean, I don't have words actually

I thought a new topic is needed for the recent events. So I took your message from this topic here.

This article was widely spread and it was also published in English. Apparently it is based on this video recording. I admire and deeply respect her commitment and determination, but don't know what to say to this. It makes me shiver. On the other hand I cannot assess the context in which she said this.

Karolina
Member
# Posted: 6 Dec 2013 22:45
Reply 


That's great idea to start new topic about this.
I'm actually scared of this... I read some comments and they're not so kind. I am afraid to even say something about this statement, I mean if she will do this (God, I hope she won't) she maybe will come out as a hero, and if she won't do that she will come out as a liar, according to these comments. Here in Lithuania we have had this "hero" who burn himself protesting Soviet regime in Lithuania and now 40 years latter people has no idea who he was and what he did. He believed that it would make some difference, but it didn't. It's so hard to say something right now. I prefer her to sing for many years and to send message to people from her songs and not to make one day statement by doing this. Alive person can do more to make this world better, I leard that this year in hard way.

cora
Moderator
# Posted: 6 Dec 2013 23:07
Reply 


Karolina
I read some comments and they're not so kind.

I mean if she will do this (God, I hope she won't) she maybe will come out as a hero, and if she won't do that she will come out as a liar,

We are not in some Arab countries where suicide bombers become martyrs. I doubt that anyone here would call this heroism and undoubtably it won't change anything like hungerstrikes don't change anything.

Alive person can do more to make this world better

No doubt about that.

I leard that this year in hard way.

I'm sorry to hear that.

cora
Moderator
# Posted: 7 Dec 2013 00:05
Reply 


How about something positive. How do you like this video of Rhythm of the Heart? Really original perspective recorded at 3:05 in the morning

Christiane
Moderator
# Posted: 7 Dec 2013 00:40 - Edited by: Christiane
Reply 


What I just read here, has deeply concerned me and I can say, that I have no words for that at the moment. Apart from, that I didn´t understand anything of what Ruslana said, committing suicide won´t change the condition of the country and it will make her beloved ones unhappy, that´s for sure. But I`m also wondering, if her speech was correctly translated anyway. We all know, that each language has expressions, which can´t be translated into another language.....the result won´t have the same meaning. I consider Ruslana as intelligent, she should know, that changes won´t happen overnight. I´m wondering how long those actions will last and what else will happen. When I listen to Ruslana´s voice on this recording, I´m really appalled and it sounds to me as Ruslana is getting more and more into some kind of fanaticism. I hope, everything goes well. Maybe Ruslana has exaggerated in what she said in order to put pressure on the government.

Guido
Member
# Posted: 7 Dec 2013 01:38
Reply 


Don't know where I got it from - this theory : Slavic people think A, say B and do C.
I called Esther. We agreed : Her husband wouldn't aprove it.
I think she wants to say : I really mean it this time that things have to change.
This is not orange revolution part II - much harder. Also much more complicated. Part I was easy : election fraud.

May I make a joke ? I'm sure Putin would be glad to deliver the gas. (I'm not laughing)

it sounds to me as Ruslana is getting more and more into some kind of fanaticism
I think she was allways like that. Perhaps now more then before.

Guido
Member
# Posted: 7 Dec 2013 04:52
Reply 


I mean if she will do this (God, I hope she won't) she maybe will come out as a hero, and if she won't do that she will come out as a liar
She is my hero. Guys don't take what she said literally.

Here in Lithuania we have had this "hero" who burn himself protesting Soviet regime in Lithuania and now 40 years latter people has no idea who he was and what he did.

Do you remember Jan Palach ? Long time ago and far away but I remember. Tsjechie ?

I´m wondering how long those actions will last and what else will happen
So am I Christiane. I don't like it at all.

Guido
Member
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 00:26
Reply 


Hatte ich noch nicht gelesen - schon wieder mal FAZ :
„Wir sind eine großartige Nation"
... Ruslana Lyschitschko, die heimliche First Lady der Ukraine. Sie war Sprachrohr der Jugend und ein Antrieb für den Umbruch.

nikoleta_rangelova
Member
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 11:42 - Edited by: nikoleta_rangelova
Reply 


It depends on the side people take actually. She won't come out as a hero, she'll be quickly forgotten, proclaimed crazy (because as far as I know she isn't considered the sanest person in Ukraine, anyway) and later used by the opposition as an argument: seeee what happened during YOUR governing? People set themselves on fire, you don't think about people, you killed people and so on.

This is what happened here earlier this year, when there were big protests in BG (there sitll are, btw, but our f**** politicians are shameless) - two or three people set themselves on fire, caused mess, attracted attention and what? Nothing. Just wasted lives. They were called crazy. And, actually, who in their right mind would do that, anyway? You die, get forgotten and then what? You can't achieve anything if dead.


P.S. If she wants to die so much, she'd better go kill a politician - they'll kill her anyway, but her death won't have been in vain ;)

nikoleta_rangelova
Member
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 12:13
Reply 


Moreover, she shouldn't forget that she's a public figure and the worse that can happen is her instigating others /unstable people or teens/ to follow her example and do it for real.

WildYennifer
Moderator
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 13:20 - Edited by: WildYennifer
Reply 


I don't understand why she said that, other than to draw attention. (I don't mean it in the arrogant draw-attention-to-herself way, I'm rather talking about attention to the seriousness of these issues.) I still don't approve of it. Like Niki said, people with radical mindsets (and there are always such) can follow this example, and even if she tries to do it, it won't make any difference. Not to mention there would be a lot of other people there and it's not like they would let her carry it through.

Edit: I read some comments on her statement, and some people call her stupid and psycho and, horrible as it sounds, say that "she should do it so we'll have fewer idiots." I think that answers the "heroism" question. (Obviously, not all people think so, but even those who support Ruslana's views in general are not happy about this statement, of course.)

cora
Moderator
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 15:24
Reply 


nikoleta_rangelova
Moreover, she shouldn't forget that she's a public figure and the worse that can happen is her instigating others /unstable people or teens/ to follow her example and do it for real.

Exactly.

WildYennifer
I read some comments on her statement,

I also read some comments. "Go ahead", "I'll buy the fuel", "Never liked her music anyway" and things like that.

Not to mention there would be a lot of other people there and it's not like they would let her carry it through.

Yes, someone would put out the fire, she would be mutilated for the rest of her life and her career over.

I'm rather talking about attention to the seriousness of these issues.)

Yes, I also think that she didn't mean it literally, but to underline the seriousness of the issue and her determinaion and conviction. But the media gladly picked it up and widely spread it in a way that in my opinion doesn't help the situation and just distracts from the real problems.

flipsty
Member
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 16:02 - Edited by: flipsty
Reply 


Please, don't set yourself on fire, dear Ruslana. The Vietnamese Buddhist monk, Thich Quang Du'c did it 50 years ago, and there have been so many copycats, that it's no longer as powerful a statement. Just makes people look like kooks. Being obnoxious is a more effective form of activism.

I believe it was probably an idle threat.

nikoleta_rangelova
Member
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 16:54
Reply 


I support the demonstrators, of course, but I keep wondering about Ruslana's words....

Actually, I've been wondering if she realizes what she's said. Because, if she doesn't intend to do it, it's pure mockery of the people who suffered or died in fire. Because, wtf, can you even imagine how it feels?! I hope not. And if she intends to do it, she'd better try holding her hand right above a lighter, candle or sth. for longer. I think most people would reconsider their "decision".

Guido
Member
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 18:41
Reply 


Yes, I also think that she didn't mean it literally, but to underline the seriousness of the issue and her determinaion and conviction
My idea too Cora.

Yesterday I read BE newspapers. Nothing about that. Crazy : I had the idea : she really has to do it before I can read about ?
I prefer not.
In fact in BE newspapers : nothing about Ukraine.

Niki : Somehow I understand what you write but I think our Ukrainian friends understand her better then we do and so don't take it literally.

I had a phone call with Anna (Hanja) - the one whose sister made that special pisanka for you.
She has contacts in Ukraine and knows a lot.

Russia didn't want Ukrainian cheese or chocalates because there were cancerogen (?) elements in it. The day Janu didn't sign the association treaty, they were ok.
Ukraine has to pay more for gas then we.
What Putin is doing : Blackmail - chantage ?
As he did before putting Ukraine without gas 01/01 ?

cora
Moderator
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 18:48
Reply 


Guido
In fact in BE newspapers : nothing about Ukraine.

But on TV.

nikoleta_rangelova
Member
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 18:50 - Edited by: nikoleta_rangelova
Reply 


Niki : Somehow I understand what you write but I think our Ukrainian friends understand her better then we do and so don't take it literally.

Well, I wonder what part of those people on the square took it figuratively if she said what we think she said.



BTW, there's been a lot about the Ukrainian demonstrations on our TV. Nothing about Ruslana and her "threat" though. I wonder why.

WildYennifer
Moderator
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 19:07 - Edited by: WildYennifer
Reply 


BTW, there's been a lot about the Ukrainian demonstrations on our TV. Nothing about Ruslana and her "threat" though. I wonder why.

Because she's just a singer, and not a politician. What she said doesn't change anything, why should your media bother?

Somehow I understand what you write but I think our Ukrainian friends understand her better then we do and so don't take it literally.

That would be me, and no, I don't understand why she said it. Maybe the intention to show the seriousness of the problem was good, but threatening to do something like that only makes people think Ruslana is crazy, not in a good way. At the end of the day, it achieves nothing except it makes some people's opinion on her worse than it was.

P.S. Nah, there's no Ukrainian context where lighting yourself on fire means something else than it does.

cora
Moderator
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 19:41
Reply 


WildYennifer
WildYennifer
Because she's just a singer, and not a politician. What she said doesn't change anything, why should your media bother?

Because she is the only Ukrainian celibrity - except for the Klitschkos - people know in Western countries. The German media is full of Ruslana these days. I keep a list of the online media coverage. There are so many articles that it's hard to keep track.

Today an article was released by the biggest German press agency dpa and by this published at least 290 times. It contains a quote from Ruslana „Today Maidan is not only the square of independence, but also of hope".

This was a really good interview with her on a major German radio channel.

The best thing was that my press release which I released right at the beginning of the protests was published in parts at least 450 times and a follow-up article with quotes from my press release published by dpa in at least 470 newspapers! Later press releases were not that successful unfortunately.

In last 2 weeks Ruslana has been in the German online news every day. I havn't seen her on TV yet, though.

WildYennifer
Moderator
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 20:27
Reply 


@cora

I've seen her in some of our news a couple of days ago. But now I'm watching probably the most popular weekly news program, and they haven't even mentioned her yet, I think (and we're almost an hour into the program). Which, I think, further proves the things I said earlier about people'a attitude.

cora
Moderator
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 20:30
Reply 


WildYennifer
Which, I think, further proves the things I said earlier about people'a attitude.

Yes, you are probably right. The suicide issue was not mentioned in German media at all by the way.

Were you at the rally today? The videos I have seen are so impressive!

Guido
Member
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 20:50
Reply 


Because she's just a singer, and not a politician. What she said doesn't change anything, why should your media bother?
Because she is good show ? :-) How many Ukrainian women do our media know ? Timo and Ruslana ?
Just a singer ? I don't know who wrote - long ago : symbol of orange revolution, icon of modern Ukraine ?

Guido
Member
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 21:13
Reply 


Guido
In fact in BE newspapers : nothing about Ukraine.

But on TV.[/i]
Wow but I was on forum, not watching TV

Christiane
Moderator
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 21:25
Reply 


cora
Yes, I also think that she didn't mean it literally, but to underline the seriousness of the issue and her determinaion and conviction.

Yes, I think so. I found a short article with a statement made by Ruslana, where she said, that she would set herself on fire at Maidan, if the situation won´t change. This can be regarded ambiguously.

http://www.focus-fen.net/?id=n320418

WildYennifer
Moderator
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 21:31 - Edited by: WildYennifer
Reply 


Were you at the rally today? The videos I have seen are so impressive!

No, I wasn't. : ) I was worried about the safety issues, given there were so many people there. Now I actually regret not going there, since everything was peaceful and yet impressive.

As for Ruslana not saying it literally, I sincerely hope so. The only thing that I want to say in this situation is that if she didn't mean it literally, she shouldn't have said it literally. That is not a phrase to be used as a figure of speech and it can be psychologically triggering for people.

nikoleta_rangelova
Member
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 21:45 - Edited by: nikoleta_rangelova
Reply 


Just because of what Karolina said (that Ruslana put herself into a very weird situation - either do it or be called a liar), I've been wondering if she (R) won't come up with some on stage show-like thing - really setting herself on fire, wearing those fireproof stunt costumes or gel, or smth. This way she'd make a point and maybe get out of the story without being called liar/crazy.

Other questions remain, though:

- What did she think she'd achieve?

- Attract attention? Whose attention? Aren't the hundreds of thousands in the streets enough? The EU knows, Russia knows, the USA know.

- Forgive me for this wording, but does she think she's so important to the government as for someone to care about her actions?

- Has she forgotten she's got a husband who supposedly loves her?

- Parents?

- Someone said she was a symbol of the Orange Revolution, but back then she was giving flowers, not setting fire

- Many years ago she was anti-drugs, anti-alcohol, anti- everything that may cause dependence or death. Now death is what she's calling for?


Even if a single one of these questions is answered positively, for me this would mean that she didn't think over what she'd say/ didn't think clearly, didn't realize what she said.

Anyway, I'm interesting what her next "move" will be or rather how she'll explain her words/ "intentions".

Thank God I'm not a fan like before, it would've broken my heart ;)

I keep wondering why she isn't on TV, though. I mean, Klichko is, so why not her. Moreover, this ... action of her is kinda sensational. Or maybe they also regard it weird.


P.S. I found it in a BG online paper, too. According to the translation, she means it more than literally, that's clear.

And I don't think that the "if no changes are made" makes her statement less literal.

cora
Moderator
# Posted: 8 Dec 2013 22:24
Reply 


nikoleta_rangelova
I absolutely agree with your thoughts.

Anyway, I'm interesting what her next "move" will be or rather how she'll explain her words/ "intentions".

I don't think that there needs to be any move or explanation. In a few days it will be forgotten anyway.

Guido
Member
# Posted: 9 Dec 2013 03:37
Reply 


I've been wondering if she (R) won't come up with some on stage show-like thing - really setting herself on fire
It is not show time now na majdani. This is not orange revolution that gave us nice Ruslana concerts. It's serious now.

Attract attention? Whose attention?
Only ours I think.

- Forgive me for this wording, but does she think she's so important to the government as for someone to care about her actions?
Should I answer : only to us ?

Let's forget what she said. She is a bit (?) impulsive and says what her heart says.
The only thing that matters to me is what she is doing for her country. So for me the putting on fire issue is closed.

Guido
Member
# Posted: 9 Dec 2013 03:55 - Edited by: Guido
Reply 


- Has she forgotten she's got a husband who supposedly loves her?
- Parents?
And one fan in Belgium :-)
- Someone said she was a symbol of the Orange Revolution, but back then she was giving flowers, not setting fire

And a nice concert

But perhaps she meant Putin on fire ? (sorry I wrote the issue is closed)

nikoleta_rangelova
Member
# Posted: 9 Dec 2013 13:25
Reply 


cora

I don't think that there needs to be any move or explanation. In a few days it will be forgotten anyway.


Sure, I just thought she might be asked questions. But perhaps nobody took it seriously.



Guido

I've been wondering if she (R) won't come up with some on stage show-like thing - really setting herself on fire
It is not show time now na majdani.


I said it in the context of Karolina's words.

. 1 . 2 . 3 . >>
Your reply
Bold Style  Italic Style  Underlined Style  Image Link  URL Link     :) ;) :-p :-( ... Disable smilies

» Username  » Password 
Only registered users can post here. Please enter your login/password details before posting a message, or register here first.
 

- Forums -



Online now: Guests - 2; Members - 0
Most users ever online: 480 [13 Dec 2014 05:10]



These forums are running on community script miniBB™ © 2001-2016 admin | Ruslana. Official site